At yesterday’s long plenary, I floated with some people a new idea.
In the current version of the sketches, we have a 1-bedroom unit of 66 m2 in the front building, next to the multi-purpose room. We also have a “Reef zone” with a living room and a guest room in Back, also of 66 m2.
So here’s my idea: what would it be like to swap the two? The advantage would be that the entire ground floor of Front would now be a common area, with a 4 meters ceiling. We could play with divisions, making the space more public as we go from the SW to the NW corner, from the guest suite through a living room accessible to Reeflings and guests of the guest room, then a kitchen, then the multi-purpose room. The space would become more elastic.
And as for light… with double exposure and 4 meter ceilings I am not really worried. We could make large, imposing, even floor-to-ceiling windows facing the garden. It would become a very spectacular space, our Town Square where everybody goes through, either because of some workshop business or to sit in a corner of the common living room, or to prepare the next event open to the neighborhood.
How do you feel about this? Worth taking it to the architects?
I think the argument of keeping all common spaces together is a strong one.
Another advantage I see is that it’s so central: everybody who comes home will see whether there is someone in the Reef zone, which will make it more likely that we’ll see each other there more often.
I have a couple of concerns though:
Sound-proofing: even if both spaces are next to each other, it’s important to me that the Reef zone can be quiet while there is a noisy event in the multi-purpose room (and vice versa).
Safety: it’s important to me that we can leave valuables in the Reef zone without too much stress.
Sunlight: even in June, at 5 pm (i.e. after work) there is no more sunlight in that bit of the garden. So that will mean shuffling chairs and drinks up and down every time we organise an apéro, which is of course not the end of the world.
Taking everything together I think I’m leaning towards having everything together in the front building, but I may also just stand aside and leave the wisdom and decision to those who feel strongly about this.
Two concerns I would add:
-If the Reef Zone, currently projected in Idefix, becomes a private appartment then the garden just behind this unit (ca 75m2) is not accessible anymore, see also second video from the presentation starting from minute 04.
-With all major commons in Obelix, the communal life will be more centred and less spread across the area ( which again also has its pros).
We had this discussion before the programme we sent to them that resulted in this version. If I remember correctly, we told them that we weren’t sure if we wanted the common spaces in one or two areas, and asked them to advise us on what was possible and/or practical. And they came back with the current split approach.
As the first version had all of the bottom floor as common space, we know that it is in fact possible, so we don’t need to ask the architects this. As both versions seem to be possible, we just have to decide which one we actually want. There are some concerns with regard to opting for the all-in-one option, but none of them seem insurmountable. As Richard says, the garden at the back would all become private space, which would perhaps strengthen the argument for that building to move closer to the wall and increase the communal garden space on the other side.
So how do we decide between the two options? If Alberto is the only one with a strong opinion on this, then a proposal to have one large common space would be consented to fairly easily and it becomes part of the increasingly decided elements of the instructions we give to the architects. I personally don’t mind either way (one common space or two). But if any @reeflings out there are attached to them being split, then this thread would be the place to start making your case…
I have no problem with the ideas and remarks launched (and hardly read)and totally agree we should have this discussion
but I would like to remind we have limited discussion time together, we have limited amount of energy if we want to reach our deadline by end of October.
So I invite us to constantly question the priority of things: discussion to have before the end of October or can it wait till after end of october?
In my vision, keeping both destinations, keeping Both destinations the same size, it is not something we need to discuss now ( but maybe to be checked with the architects to be absolutely sur), meaning: i don’t think the commune cares where we put our reef only zone: in the front or back building
I was very uncertain initially and more leaning overall towards the all-in-Obelix side. Got quite excited with the Idefix option though. But obviously can still go either direction still.
Although re light, I guess we can move our apero out to the sun, but then we can’t seat inside in the sun behind the window when it’s too cold to be outside for a long time…
I agree with else that we don’t necessarily need to make a choice now, but we should indeed ask the architects as they might not configure the space exactly the same in idefix if it’s for an apartment (shape of the space?).
Reading over all the comments above I would lean more towards keeping the common spaces separate:
it is nicer to have the common spaces spread out over the whole plot so everyone will come to another part of the plot once in a while
having the most sunny spot of the garden in front of the common living room is an advantage because this is a spot in the garden where people will meet for sure
when it’s colder, it is nice to sit in the sun inside behind the glass. as a lot of apartments don’t have sun inside, it is nice to have this aspect in the common living room
But again, I don’t have a strong opinion, so I won’t stand in the way if we would decide to put all the common spaces in the front again.
my understanding (but maybe to be checked with the architects), there is no such thing is an affectation ‘common spaces’. There is nothing foreseen towards cohousings, so ‘common spaces doesn’t exist in their dictionnary’.
for me the affectations the commune cares about is
'housing destination (our private units and common spaces, social units) ,
commercial destination,
maybe garden
and then there are other elements that might help to commune to be convinced (social units), the fact we have a space open to the neighbourhood (don’t know if this falls under housing destination’, it might not.)
So my assumption is that the reef only zone is considered as ‘housing’ affectation.
Maybe I created confusion by saying that common spaces/private spaces felt under the ‘affectation’ round on saturday. For me this was an important topic as the proportion of commons/private units has an impact on the price, and that is also something we need to agree on…
It looks like we’ll be doing some rounds to see where everybody stands on this, so if you have space it would be lovely it you could give this some thought.
One thing that is important to me is to get to this discussion with a shared understanding of the sizes and the number of people we will be.
On the number of people, the estimated numbers are around 33 adults and 7 children. The file with the estimation is saved in Team R&O’s folder: Login – Nextcloud
On the sizes, one reference we have is my own apartment, which is 75 m² net, which would be 90-95 m² brut. The width of the living room is about 6 meters, and from front to back is about 13 meters, all net. A sketch of the plan is saved in the estimations folder: Login – Nextcloud
As agreed at the last plenary we will NOT yet be talking about the price increase. At the same time it is imporant to be aware of the fact that nothing is for free, hence my invitation to get a feel for the size of spaces, as this will be one possible option to bring down the price a little.
A final suggestion to get a feel for the size of spaces would be to visit the blue-yellow pre-portal of hell that sells furniture around the globe, where they note the size of the rooms and mini-houses they have on demo. This could also be useful for your own unit. I wrote something about that here: What a small unit could look like - #3 by Lee
