A question concerning the simulation file i created to calculate the price of your unit, including weighting, markup, finishing (of your choice), options (of your choice or mandatory).
Right now this simulation file ‘Price calculator January 2025’ (under TB/plans) takes into account certain things we’ve consented to, but not all, and that might create confusion. So I would like to have your advice on this…
What is this price calculation based on?
It is based on the last price calculation received by the architects, which was the one after they added the ‘entree couvertes’, which maide the price per m2 rise to 4460 euro/m2.
What i have modified in this simulation file (and maybe now regretting it) is:
I have updated the price of the options to the price that was in the proposal of Team finance (concerning the price of the options) and that was consented to in the last PM.
As the options are not neutral in this calculations , this has an impact on the price per m2 and thus on the final price of the units.
What i didn’t modify in the simulation file (yet):
the 16 m2 we gain by moving the buanderie to obelix (either ground floor or -1)
the 20 m2 of atelier (cost) to add, as we increase the m2 of common space
the 19,5 m2 we gain by giving oaktree not the 4 groundfloor studios in Asterix (each with an entree couverte) but 2 groundfloor studios in Asterix and 2 +1 floor studiosi in Asterix. The loss of 5 m2 because of extra corridor on level +1 of Asterix is included in the +19,5 m2.
…
So - like I said- I regret a bit the update of the price of the options. I think it would be better to keep the calculation equal to the last calculation of the architects. So i would propose to remove the update of the price of the options.
It’s then up to team finance, to decide what happens with all the ‘money we safe mainly’ with the above changes.
I incredibly appreciate your work. It’s invaluable in ways that are difficult to describe.
For the price calculator my recommendation would be to consider whether it is necessary to spend time on this now. The current situation is still in flux, and this is what we will tell the newlings: the calculator gives an approximate amount, and it will only be in a couple of months that we will get more precision.
Does that sound reasonable?
On the side, one small request regarding the price calculator would be to announce when you make changes to it. This is because we are asked to download it, and so I imagine many people continue to play around with the version they have downloaded, without going back to Nextcloud to see if there is a newer version.
I have a rather extreme view on this: the price calculator is no longer needed. It may even confuse users if they do not fully understand the assumptions behind it.
Once upon a time, we needed a price calculator to make rough estimates before dividing the building in units and pricing them. But now we have done that: each unit has an exact surface and a weighting coefficient. We also have a decision on the options. We can get to precise estimates in very few steps with just addition and multiplication. So, I recommend you calculate your price yourself, in order to have a firmer understanding of how the price is formed, and, consequently, of how you can influence it. This is how you do it:
take the latest estimate of the average price.
multiply by the surface of your unit.
multiply by the weighting coefficient of your unit.
add the options.
That’s your casco price. Now add finishing:
Decide on a price per m2 of the finishing (800 EUR for basic or 1,200 for super fancy?)
multiply by the surface.
And finally
Set aside a little money for the deed. If you have a right to the abattement, that is going to be less than 3K.
That’s your price. If you do this on a spreadsheet, you will have made your own price calculator, one that you understand 100%.
As a final note, I highly recommend adding some safety margin. It could be done by taking a slightly pessimistic average price in step 1; or it could be a lump sum (“let’s add an extra 20K to the total, just in case”) or a percentage at the very end (“let’s add an extra 2% to the total, just in case”). Only after doing that, to calculate how much money you will need to have on hand, add the 10% unforeseen contingencies.
Why? Because then you won’t have to worry that every little decision of external circumstances (think increases of raw materials prices) will break your system.
Based on my own experience, life becomes a lot easier and less stressful if you aim a little lower than you can afford. I appreciate this might not be possible for everybody. However, the cohousing situation helps: maybe you can make do with a smaller balcony because you have access to a large garden. Maybe your living room can be small and cozy because you have access to a much larger common one, and if you want to organize a dinner with 15 people you can simply move it there. This sort of thing. This for me is also the logic that pushes investing in common spaces.
@els I think the price calculator is broken in the lower rows. From what I can see the price of the options is no longer added up to the casco + finishings higher up.
More fundamentally I’m a bit worried about the calculator. I can somehow pretend that I understand the need for it (the post you link to higher up, in reply to Mieke), but the last time I did a simulation my unit cost 200k more than the casco price that is in the architects’ weighting file. That means a cost of 2000 euro per square meter on top of the casco price, which is clearly wrong. Are you sure the calculator gives a realistic estimate of the total price?
I don’t pretend people should use this, or this is a good idea (i basically made it for myself to do simulations)
I also share the fear that people do updates of the simulator, breaking it for other people and giving really unrealistic figures (or even me quickly simulate things and change things )
I am not saying there aren’t any mistakes, i asked people to give me feedback. Only sarah contacted me and i checked her worry, but it seemed to be ok
I do have a worry, that people won’t know how to do the calculation, with the markup, including a 10% safety margin… The simulation files also indicates what mandatory terraces are there, so people are not surprised at the end of the ride.
so @reef-recruitment : let me know if you see a need?
If there would be a need, i see maybe a solution which prevents things getting corrupted:
Calculate all the prices of the left over units and just present them in a file, maybe with a variation of finishing (750 , 900 , 1000), and with mandatory option and the price of not mandatory options (to just add them themselves)
i don’t have so much work right now, and i love doing this, so i don’t mind spending some time on it, if there is a need., so just let me know, no wrong answer… (for now i will delete it, as you seem to think it is corrupted)
(lee, i think one reason you might have gotten an amount that is much bigger than you had in mind, is because i based myself on the m2 mentionned on the plans send for weighing. Your unit is on there 105 m2,so that might explain it)
For me this goes beyond Team Recruitment, as I see people using the file without a critical check of how it works and whether the outcome makes sense.
So personally my preferred solution would be twofold:
A very simple calculator (no sub-tabs etc) along the lines of the one that Alberto describes above, where people need to fill in all their data themselves
A list of prices of the remaining units, with coursives but without options
Last time I saw François he said that 750 is not a realistic number, because it doesn’t include VAT and fees (his words). Can it please be an option to bring this question back, and ask them how much we should add per square meter to go from their casco price to the price with finishings?
I am seriously number-blind, but it’s not that bad
)
