External facilitator to facilitate the meeting(s) related to the finalization of the avant projet

Hi @reef-facilitation ,

In today’s coordination meeting, we wondered if it wouldn’t be a good idea to look for an external facilitator for the meeting(s) where we will need to take some decisions to finalize the avant projet.

So we are talking about the meeting in the weekend of the 19th (ongoing poll: Extra plenary to talk about the avant-projet: weekend 18 April) and on 25/4.

Could you look into that?

To give some more context: to finalize the avant projet we will need to take some decisions:

  • type of heatpump

  • finishing facade: bricks or metal

  • structure: classic or CLT

These decisions are not purely a question of money, but are also linked to durability and other aspects …

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We are having a meeting with team facilitation next week and I will put it on our agenda.

Hi @reef-coordination group,

In order to organise the external facilitation, we need more info about the associated need. Is it that the external facilitator has to know about heat pumps and facades, as well as facilitating a sociocratic meeting? Or are the decisions expected to be of such a complicated nature that we need someone with a lot of experience? Or something else…

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Hi Chris,

It’s more the latter.

We are not looking for somebody who knows the technical aspects of the decisions to take, that the coordination group should be able to do, based on the info of architects and bureau d’études.

The difficulty will be: coming to a proposal to which everybody of the group can consent to by the end of the month. As there are several aspects that play, which will be at times contradictory ( financial Vs sustainability, financial Vs beauty, …), I think this won’t be an easy one…

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Hi @reef-coordination group,

After your request, I reached out to the some groups that I know of in Brussels who work with organisations like ours, to check availability, suitability and cost. I wasn’t able to find anyone who would specifically facilitate a sociocratic meeting, but there are external facilitators for decision-making in small organisations; however, none available at such short notice.

We had a Team Facilitation meeting last night, and discussed the pros and cons of having a non-sociocratic facilitator for this particular meeting. Some of the team members have experience of inviting external facilitators to particular meetings, with mixed results. The external facilitator needs to be extensively briefed, and even then will not completely understand the group’s dynamics, aims and challenges.

It’s also still not clear what the problem is that we’re trying to solve. I imagine it will essentially be a series of selection processes between two or more options, where there will inevitably be a tension between spending money, on the one hand, and sustainability, beauty, etc., on the other. It’ll be challenging, but not necessarily complicated. From talking to various members recently, my personal opinion is that the common spaces decision that we made has given people more appreciation of allowing the group intelligence to guide us and accepting the collective decisions. That may be a wildly optimistic take on things. However, if it turns out that there is an irreconcilable tension between the less affluent and those willing and/or able to spend more on sustainability/beauty/etc., then I’m not sure an external facilitator, sociocratic or otherwise, will be able to resolve that on a decision-by-decision basis.

This post is becoming way longer than I intended :-/

There are still three options on the table:

Option 1, we ask Collectiv-a again. It turns out that Joannes knows them quite well, so they may be more receptive to helping at short notice if he asks them.
Pros
Cheap
Experienced
Cons
Non-sociocratic
May not solve the problem

Option 2, we could ask Sociocracy For All to provide someone. As they have quite pool of trained external facilitators, they could probably provide someone at short notice. But it would not be cheap and would almost certainly involve an online meeting.
Pros
Probably available
Sociocratic
Cons
Probably expensive
Probably online

Option 3, Team Facilitation takes responsibility for the meeting, with input from the Coordination Team, and with more preparation with regard to the various scenarios we might face. Both Joke and Joannes have training and experience in facilitation, decision-making and group dynamics, so we could approach this meeting more as a team and with greater flexibility.
I think the pros and cons are fairly self-evident.

Happy to hear more from you on this topic…

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  • I don’t know if this is the way to tackle it. Say there are 3 decisions to take

    • A far more expensive than B, but A more sustainable than B

    • C more expensive than D, but C more beautiful than D

    • E more expensive in buying than F, but E less expensive on the long run than F and E more sustainable than F
      Say you would tackle this one by one, and you go for A for the first decision. By chosing A, you might exclude C and E because you have gone for sth expensive already…Ideally you would need to look at it as a whole , or prioritize or sth.

  • I understand that external facilitation is not a guarantee for a better outcome, or ideal. Maybe just looking into facilitation techniques for this situation?
    Having said that, i don’t know what to expect from the architects. Maybe some of the decisions will be easy to take as they will be way too expensive, or maybe most of the things will be in budget, hard to say?

  • In any case, whether it is an external facilitator or not, I think it might be a good idea to plan some moment between some member(s) of the coorditation group with team facilitation to discuss/explain things before the PM of the 20th

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Hi @els!

When I say a ‘series of selection processes’ I mean for different decisions, not within the same decision. A selection process can be for more than two choices at a time, as we do when we select for a role. The success of such a technique largely depends on the prep beforehand, so that members are fully aware of the choices in front of them before we get to the process of deciding itself. It is important to avoid counter proposals coming up at the last minute, or revisions to one of the choices in a decision that could have been addressed beforehand. For this reason…

Yes indeed! The sooner the better… :slight_smile:

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hi @reef-facilitation : we normally have a meeting with the architects on Monday 14/04 to go over the estimates of the avant-projet, but Walk still hasn’t delivered their part so I am starting to fear that this date will be postponed.

If it would be kept, the coordination team is meeting on Wednesday, so I would say keep next Thursday and Friday free for now

I am not sure I have the same faith in sociocracy with regards to the decisions we will need to take shortly. Sociocratic facilitation is meant to happen in groups of maximum five, not fifteen. (Also, with regard to option 2, fun fact: I am a SoFA certified facilitator :sweat_smile:).

The interdependence of the different issues may also be a complicating factor, and I think that at some point it may be beneficial to have somebody to lead the conversation who doesn’t have any stakes in it. This is also what I remember they recommended us in Tivoli.

As for the way forward: we’ll know more about what’s on the table and which will be the difficult issues at the plenary of the 15th. I can attend a Team Facilitation meeting on the 16th if need be.

Can it be an option that Team Facilitation takes on the meeting on the 20th, and that you see whether an external facilitator could be available for the final decisions on the 25th?

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For the record, I would be more than happy to go with an external facilitator if that is a better option to get these important decisions made well and quickly…

Having said that, I would like to be clearer about why we are doing that and what we are trying to put in place, not least because it is deviating from our governance document.

The implication is that the facilitator would be unable to be impartial with regard to leading a discussion in the group’s interests. If that were the case, we would need external facilitation for a lot of decisions – past, present and future. I personally don’t think it’s difficult to separate one’s personal preferences from that which is best for the group when facilitating, but if anyone feels differently, it’s a serious concern that should be addressed as soon as possible…

Then we need to rewrite the governance document to be clearer about what we put in its place. In the Sociocracy for All training that I did on conflict management, lack of clarity and agreement about decision-making processes was one of the most significant dangers to group cohesion. Level 4 decisions (impactful and costly to reverse) currently require consent by Full Members. We have a section on what to do when ‘things get a bit more complicated’, which could be applied here, but it still involves sociocratic selection processes and multi-voting. If we are saying now that when things are more complicated, we get external facilitation and use whatever method they are used to working with, then we should probably have proposed that previously? It could still be a simple online consent proposal, and I could try and line up some external facilitation in the meantime…

Els and I have the Q&A session at 7.30 on Wednesday evening, but I could be available an hour before that. I can also free up Thursday evening, if need be. Tagging @Jook and @joannes to be a part of that, as Team Facilitation.

I will recontact Collectiv-a, Altera Projects and ToolBox tomorrow, to see if they can provide someone on the 25th, just in case that is the direction we decide to take. If anyone knows of other organisations that provide external facilitation for groups such as ours, I’d be happy to hear about them…

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I’m available on Wednesday and Thursday evening.

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Hi @ChrisM,

I’m not sure I understand why we need to change our governance model just because we would hire an external facilitator.

There are two fundamental things taken from sociocracy that we will always rely on:

  • Separating a decision-making process into understand-explore-decide
  • Deciding by consent (consensus for level 5)

My experience is that sociocractic rounds run into their limitations when the group becomes to big. I have made a suggestion about that one year ago (Team Facilitation: two small things in the context of the 2023 review). It was completely accepted last year, just not followed up upon (which I admit has been a bit of a source of frustration to me). Using alternative methods, especially for difficult and important decisions, is what I understand to be something most cohousings have done.

The idea of hiring an external facilitator would only apply to the “explore” stage, not the “decide” one. I therefore don’t see a problem related to our governance model.

As for having a person without skin in the game, I do believe this has added value in difficult conversations. I am not saying you are not doing a good job as our facilitator, it’s just that I believe that somebody has no stakes and no history in the group, will have a different view on things, which may help us to get to a conclusion faster and with less friction.

On Signal you proposed that I facilitate some topics myself on the 25th, because I have some training and experience, and because I know The Reef inside out. To be very honest, sometimes I do have the desire to facilitate a bit, because I enjoy it. At the same time I worry that it can be difficult to combine with the role that I am in. So depending on the topic (the ones that leave me cold), I’d be happy to contribute where I can.

Happy to hear how this lands with you.

Plus a request to @mieke: as the Coordinator of Team Facilitation, would you be willing to go back to my post of last year (linked above) and see whether this something the team would be willing to pick up again?

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Thanks for your very clear response @Lee !

I understood from Els’ original post in this thread that an external facilitator was needed to make the decisions. If that is not the case, and actually the external facilitation is being suggested for the explore phase, then most of what I’ve said is pretty much redundant. And of course there’s no need to change our governance model to do so.

As I said above, I can contact various organisations that offer external facilitation tomorrow. However…

I still think this is the best way forward if it is something you would be open to. You have more training and experience in terms of facilitation than anyone else, and the advantage of understanding well the topics at hand. As you said above, combining facilitating with presenting proposals is not always ideal. But in this case, if you would like to facilitate the meeting on the 20th and the meeting on the 25th, in order to get these particular decisions made well and efficiently, it would certainly be fine with me, and I think would be a win for the group (i.e. we save money and still end up with appropriate facilitation of a high quality).

What to you think?

PS - At the Team Facilitation meeting last week we talked about the historical lack of effort in acquiring new techniques, and made plans to move forward in doing so. @joannes, in particular, as a lot of experience in this, so he will be a useful ally when thinking about these upcoming plenaries, if you decide to facilitate them and would like some support…

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